Dosakai - round, yellow Indian cucumbers, (split from Indian Pickles thread) Options

[Geeta]

[bhaaskar]

[shanta]

I've seen yellow as well as greenish ones at the local Indain stores, which is better and are they both tart?

I'd used dosakai in:
- dosas instead of cucumber - didn't make any big difference.
- ambat with spinach - this was my first time with dosakai and it was very sour, didn't expect dosakais to be tart and I'd added tamarind paste!

Are these (or related to) Mangalore cucumbers(Magge) which are bigger in size? Don't think the M'lore cucumbers are tart, sometimes they are sweet like melons called chibbad in Konkani.

[Geeta]

Thanks Bhaskar and Shanta,

I guess since this is a cucumber, we could taste it raw to see if it's tart or not.

When you cook it does the cucumber stay firm or does it get dossolved?

[bhaaskar]

[lakme]

A similar kind of yellow/green striated cucumber is also used extensively in Kerala, where its called "vellarikai." Tastes good in buttermilk stews, koottu etc. One fabulous combination is vellarikai with jackfruit seeds(i remember a discussion abt these elsewhere on AS), made into koottu or molagushiyam- a sort of peppery stew. Its not at all sour though, in fact, its blandness allows it to absorb flavors better. Shanta, does this sound like the "magge" you mention?

[shanta]

[Trips]

thems dosakkai. but they shouldn't be squishy, i think.

thanks, ging. now that i know what it's called, will be easy to find recipes. what's it called in english and hindi? it is tough on the outside but the inside is soft like a melon. i used it in dal today and didn't much care for it cooked that way.

[arnab]

is of the cucumber family, i believe. this has been a report from my division of useless and possibly wrong information.

[seeker]

They make very nice - and hot! - pachadis and chutneys with dosakkai in Andhra. I found a pachidi recipe that is similar to the one my grandmother used to make.

Dosakkai pachadi

[lakme]

This is called vellarikai in Tamil/Malayalam- used in moar kozhambu, molagooshiyam, molagootal (both lentil-veg combinations) etc.

[hibiscus]

It looks like what is called magge'n (nasal 'n') in Konkani. Another name...

[shanta]

they do, but magge'n are not sour, right? these are much smaller in size compared to magge'n.

[Wildflower]

thems dosakkai. but they shouldn't be squishy, i think.

thanks, ging. now that i know what it's called, will be easy to find recipes. what's it called in english and hindi? it is tough on the outside but the inside is soft like a melon. i used it in dal today and didn't much care for it cooked that way.

If it was soft like a melon then it was too far gone. It should be crisp inside.
And as for not liking it in dal, that is just conclusive proof that you have no Andhra-Godavari gushing in your heartu (properly spelled aartu)** You can make salsa-ish raw pacchadis with it like Seeger suggests or just remove the pulp and seeds, and eat it in salad.


**: Another very Andhra preparation is a dosakaya "gullabajji", a sour kozhambu-ish (no tamarind, all the sour taste comes from the dosakaya) thing you eat with plain arhar dal.

This post has been edited by Wildflower: Jul 23 2007, 11:01 AM

[seeker]

thems dosakkai. but they shouldn't be squishy, i think.

thanks, ging. now that i know what it's called, will be easy to find recipes. what's it called in english and hindi? it is tough on the outside but the inside is soft like a melon. i used it in dal today and didn't much care for it cooked that way.

If it was soft like a melon then it was too far gone. It should be crisp inside.
And as for not liking it in dal, that is just conclusive proof that you have no Andhra-Godavari gushing in your heartu (properly spelled aartu)** You can make salsa-ish raw pacchadis with it like Seeger suggests or just remove the pulp and seeds, and eat it in salad.


**: Another very Andhra preparation is a dosakaya "gullabajji", a sour kozhambu-ish (no tamarind, all the sour taste comes from the dosakaya) thing you eat with plain arhar dal.

WF, do you have this gullabajji recipe? Also, my grandmother ( who was from Guntur and ) used to make a chutney with dosakkai which I liked a lot, but I can't seem to find a recipe anywhere - on the web that is.

[gingerly]

several recipes linked from this blog.

[Wildflower]

WF, do you have this gullabajji recipe? Also, my grandmother ( who was from Guntur and ) used to make a chutney with dosakkai which I liked a lot, but I can't seem to find a recipe anywhere - on the web that is.

Guntur. Well then you've got Krishna and Kaveri gushing.

I only ever get dosakayas when I go to the distant land that is Sunnyvale, and even then, they are a bit phusaDDi like the one Trips got. Gullabajji is something I make in a sort of bit of this, oops bit of that too, taste, why doesn't it taste like Amma's, oh forgot x, better add that way. Will see if I can extract a more reasonable recipe from my mother.

As for the raw pacchadis there are many, many different variants. There is even one that is a bit like Frangi's raw kairi chutney recipe. Once again I'll have to cross examine my mother.

This is making me wonder -- did Bhaaskar ever post a recipe for a proper Andhra sour fruit pacchadi (green mango, tomato, or sour dosakaya etc etc)? These pacchadis don't have yogurt in them. You know the more complex Mexican salsas? With roasted or smoked ingredients -- these pacchadis seem like distant relatives of those -- relatives who get high on hing and mustard seeds.

This post has been edited by Wildflower: Jul 23 2007, 11:29 AM

[lakme]

they do, but magge'n are not sour, right? these are much smaller in size compared to magge'n.

Have to consult Ammini on this- but the vellarikkai used in Kerala is not sour either. In fact, its really bland and spongy, so it serves as a good vehicle to absorb other flavors.

[seeker]

they do, but magge'n are not sour, right? these are much smaller in size compared to magge'n.

Have to consult Ammini on this- but the vellarikkai used in Kerala is not sour either. In fact, its really bland and spongy, so it serves as a good vehicle to absorb other flavors.

In Tamil, I thought vellarikkai just referred to the ordinary cucumber - which is not sour at all. And what is put in aviyals, kozhambus, morkozhambus etc is the vellai pushnikai ( white pumpkin), which again isn't sour. Vellai pushnikai looks a lot like dosakkai but without the orangish colouring. Could the Kerala vellarikkai be the Tamil vellai pushnikkai and the dosakkai be something quite different? Ammini?

This post has been edited by seeker: Jul 23 2007, 07:04 PM

[loislane]

This is making me wonder -- did Bhaaskar ever post a recipe for a proper Andhra sour fruit pacchadi (green mango, tomato, or sour dosakaya etc etc)? These pacchadis don't have yogurt in them. You know the more complex Mexican salsas? With roasted or smoked ingredients -- these pacchadis seem like distant relatives of those -- relatives who get high on hing and mustard seeds.

Speaking of bhaaskar, I think she had brought a batch of dosakai pickle to the infamous riot at the Getty. I found one Andhra recipe here.

[dpi]

they do, but magge'n are not sour, right? these are much smaller in size compared to magge'n.

Have to consult Ammini on this- but the vellarikkai used in Kerala is not sour either. In fact, its really bland and spongy, so it serves as a good vehicle to absorb other flavors.

Vellai pushnikai looks a lot like dosakkai but without the orangish colouring. Could the Kerala vellarikkai be the Tamil vellai pushnikkai and the dosakkai be something quite different? Ammini?

no Seeker. vellai pushini in Tamil is elavan is malayalam. vellarikai is a different veg -looks a lot like a cucumber but bigger in size and not sour either. 'bland' as lakme points out.

[Ammini]

DPI is right, pusinikai of Tamil Nadu is eleavan in Kerala. It is also called kumbalanga in Malayalam. Vellarikka looks very similar to Andhra dosakai in color, but shape is longer.

[lakme]

Ammini, so dosakai is not vellarikai, right?

[Ammini]

Ammini, so dosakai is not vellarikai, right?

Lakme: I have never seen such small vellarikka in Kerala. They are never round in shape. But the skin color is exactly the same. I find dosakai a good substitute for vellarikka when making aviyal. May be wildflower can give the botanical explanation.

[armagod]

no Seeker. vellai pushini in Tamil is elavan is malayalam. vellarikai is a different veg -looks a lot like a cucumber but bigger in size and not sour either. 'bland' as lakme points out.

From memory, vellarikka is used in Tamil for all varieties of cucumber, including both the salad cucumber and the yellow cooking dosakaya. [I also remember the salad cucumber being referred to as a dosakaya by my folks.]

The dosakaya is also used to make a variety of avakai [not a fan].

[gingerly]

a green vellarikka
a yellow one
and another yellow one

to add to the mix, there's a striped yellow version of the last one (seen sinking into a cushion) that's sometimes sour!

melo yellow

There are cucumber-like forms (used as salad) with crisp flesh like Kakri (C. melo var. utilissimus Duthie & Fullar) of North India, and Vellarikkai (or Vellarikkaya) and Vellari of South India. These are also other types like Dosa Kaya of Andhra Pradesh, which are called cooking cucumbers. Another important variety Kachri is probably a semi-domesticate grown in semi-arid conditions of Rajasthan and it carries resistance to CGMMV. These non-dessert forms are economically important since these are being consciously cultivated. Studies on genetic divergence and isozyme variation have shown their close affinity with dessert melon varieties. Cytological studies have shown primitive features of their chromosomes and analysis of oil content in seeds of these varieties has shown lower values than dessert kinds. Significantly all these non-dessert kinds are monoecious in sex form, and also represent a significant secondary course of diversification of Cucumis melo in India.

[dpi]

a green vellarikka
a yellow one
and another yellow one

the first and third pictures look like the vellarikkai used in Aviyals,pachadis.

This post has been edited by dpi: Jul 27 2007, 12:41 AM

[Veena]

Have we resolved whether dosakai is the same as maggey, which is widely grown in South Canara and used in Konkani cuisine? From the descriptions and photo links of dosakai here, I don't believe they are the same. I am not sure whether vellarikka is the same as maggey either.

Here are some baby maggey that my aunt gave me when I visited her in South Canara. The mature versions are less green, more golden. I will photograph the cross-section if I am around when they are being cut and cooked.

ps: Incidentally, the staff at the hotel in Manipal where we were staying, stopped calling us ma'am and switched to maami when they saw the items we used to return to the hotel with: magge, raw jackfruit, drumsticks, bags of rice, papad, buttermilk churner...you get the picture.



Veena