 words derived from non-desi languages, not simple loans |
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| arnab |
 Sep 26 2009, 04:00 AM
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#1
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 bandwidth glutton Group: founding members Posts: 15125 Joined: 21-July 04 From: northfield, minnesota Member No.: 1  |
i don't mean things like "truck" or "train" or "station" which have entered hindi, bengali and other languages more or less unchanged except for pronunciation.
i am thinking of words like "twawlay" or "tawliya" for "towel" (assuming, of course, that they are indeed derived from "towel"). are there others? or am i drawing a meaningless distinction? -------------------- yeh sab kya ho raha hai, beta duryodhan? arnab@anothersubcontinent.com |
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| deedawar |
Sep 26 2009, 09:53 AM
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#2
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member Group: bandwidth eaters Posts: 3136 Joined: 3-October 06 Member No.: 2891 |
-------------------- "There is a path to Truth. From ignorance to relative knowledge. From relative knowledge to an awareness of the limitation of such knowledge. And finally, we pass from that which we recognize as loosely associated intelligence to a reality of Being." -- Richard Rose
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| frangipani |
Sep 27 2009, 01:46 AM
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#3
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 bandwidth eater Group: moderators Posts: 5054 Joined: 17-May 05 Member No.: 486 |
Are you looking for words that are borrowed from other languages and recognizable, but have mutated either in spelling or pronunciation? Like TamaaTar?
I guess one would have to map loanwords according to the degrees of mutation, but would likely have to have some kind of temporal band - in the last 50 years, in the last 100 years, kind of thing. Otherwise, words from Persian and Arabic (and English?) are now so deeply enmeshed in contemporary Indian languages that classifying them as non-desi words also is meaningless. For a glimpse into a debate over loanwords from Persian/Arabic in contemporary Urdu usage, see this piece by Shamsur Rahman Faruqi (pdf). -------------------- I'd rather have an orchestra in front of me, than a helicopter behind.
- Sadanand |
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| Trips |
Sep 29 2009, 09:34 AM
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#4
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 member Group: bandwidth eaters Posts: 2046 Joined: 25-August 05 Member No.: 793 |
Offhand can think of paltan (from platoon), tuufan (from typhon), monsoon (from mausam).
How about agni (is it from igneous? not sure). Is patloon from pantaloon? -------------------- come on baby, light my fire
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| sadanand |
Sep 29 2009, 06:29 PM
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#5
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 member Group: bandwidth eaters Posts: 1372 Joined: 7-February 07 Member No.: 6148 |
QUOTE(Trips @ Sep 29 2009, 09:34 AM)  Offhand can think of paltan (from platoon), tuufan (from typhon), monsoon (from mausam). How about agni (is it from igneous? not sure). Is patloon from pantaloon? Agni is not from igneous. The latin ignis and the Sanskrit agni commonly derive from an older proto Indo-European tongue for fire. -------------------- Khorrrrhhhrrrrr -- psssheeew
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| Expatobserver |
Nov 1 2009, 10:46 PM
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#6
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member Group: loiterers Posts: 27 Joined: 31-October 09 Member No.: 69894 |
QUOTE(Trips @ Sep 28 2009, 11:04 PM) Offhand can think of paltan (from platoon), tuufan (from typhon), monsoon (from mausam). How about agni (is it from igneous? not sure). Is patloon from pantaloon? Tuufan is from Typhoon which is from the Chinese Tai feng (Too much wind). |
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| Sue Darlow |
Nov 1 2009, 11:22 PM
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#7
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 member Group: bandwidth eaters Posts: 2781 Joined: 17-September 04 Member No.: 129 |
batata?
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| armagod |
Nov 2 2009, 05:48 PM
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#8
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 member Group: bandwidth eaters Posts: 3338 Joined: 2-August 04 From: london Member No.: 38 |
Modified from portuguese: mistri, balti, chabi (key), ispat, kaju, girjaghar (church), almari, chhaap (stamp)
also (but may be from arabic): kamra, kameez Incidentally I just checked and the portuguese for towel is toalha, so that might be the more direct source. -------------------- "Jiggery pokery, trickery chokery,
How did he open me up? Robbery! Muggery! Aussie skull-duggery! Out for a buggering duck." |
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| armagod |
Nov 2 2009, 06:13 PM
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#9
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member Group: bandwidth eaters Posts: 3338 Joined: 2-August 04 From: london Member No.: 38 |
QUOTE(Expatobserver @ Nov 1 2009, 10:46 PM) QUOTE(Trips @ Sep 28 2009, 11:04 PM) Offhand can think of paltan (from platoon), tuufan (from typhon), monsoon (from mausam). How about agni (is it from igneous? not sure). Is patloon from pantaloon? Tuufan is from Typhoon which is from the Chinese Tai feng (Too much wind). But also see typhon/tuphon. -------------------- "Jiggery pokery, trickery chokery,
How did he open me up? Robbery! Muggery! Aussie skull-duggery! Out for a buggering duck." |
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| Expatobserver |
Dec 17 2009, 02:54 AM
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#10
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member Group: loiterers Posts: 27 Joined: 31-October 09 Member No.: 69894 |
Why are we not discussing the words that desi languages have contributed to English, arguably the world's most popular language.
Untold number (unginat in Hindi/Urdu) of blacks are walking around in Bronx thinking that motherfucker is a pure English word. Not so, as we all know. It comes from desi word matherchod. Somehow they have not picked up a similar word involving sister. |
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| shrikar |
Dec 18 2009, 06:53 AM
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#11
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member Group: maha contributors Posts: 837 Joined: 21-April 06 Member No.: 1462 |
Off topic, but there are certain names that have come into vogue from a non-desi language - Jarnail and Karnail and of course the esteemed name of an ex President Zail!
Peace. Is there a thread for desi words migrating to English? Shanti. |
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| shrikar |
Dec 18 2009, 07:01 AM
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#12
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member Group: maha contributors Posts: 837 Joined: 21-April 06 Member No.: 1462 |
Apologies - again off topic -I have never heard English spoken in the Bronx, I have stepped into that territory several times.
Peace. |
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| Mamallan |
Dec 19 2009, 07:47 AM
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#13
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 member Group: bandwidth eaters Posts: 2543 Joined: 2-July 05 Member No.: 646 |
QUOTE(Expatobserver @ Dec 17 2009, 02:54 AM) Why are we not discussing the words that desi languages have contributed to English, arguably the world's most popular language. Untold number (unginat in Hindi/Urdu) of blacks are walking around in Bronx thinking that motherfucker is a pure English word. Not so, as we all know. It comes from desi word matherchod. Somehow they have not picked up a similar word involving sister. maderchod is a hindi/urdu word. as i understand the word desi is used to refer more generally to things south asian not just hindi/urdu. -------------------- the other day they asked me about mandatory drug testing. i said i believed in drug testing a long time ago. all through the sixties i tested everything -- former red sox pitcher bill "the spaceman" lee
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| Mrinalini |
Dec 19 2009, 11:43 AM
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#14
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member Group: bandwidth eaters Posts: 1255 Joined: 25-November 05 Member No.: 1024 |
is there a culture that does not have cuss words involving genitalia, mothers/sisters/assorted female family members? i remember asking my male friend in college who was casually addressing his friend with these expletives (sort of like certain women these days calling each other bitches in a random way), why insult the very place that every human emerges from, into this wondrous place called earth.
-------------------- jo darr gaya, samjho mar gaya.
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| Expatobserver |
Dec 20 2009, 03:15 AM
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#15
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member Group: loiterers Posts: 27 Joined: 31-October 09 Member No.: 69894 |
QUOTE(Mrinalini @ Dec 19 2009, 01:13 AM) is there a culture that does not have cuss words involving genitalia, mothers/sisters/assorted female family members? i remember asking my male friend in college who was casually addressing his friend with these expletives (sort of like certain women these days calling each other bitches in a random way), why insult the very place that every human emerges from, into this wondrous place called earth. Mrunal, believe me, all the men in this forum respect and love the wondrous place every human emerges from! |
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| Mrinalini |
Dec 20 2009, 11:45 AM
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#16
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member Group: bandwidth eaters Posts: 1255 Joined: 25-November 05 Member No.: 1024 |
QUOTE(Expatobserver @ Dec 20 2009, 03:15 AM) Mrunal, believe me, all the men in this forum respect and love the wondrous place every human emerges from! you missed the point. i am outta here. -------------------- jo darr gaya, samjho mar gaya.
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